Keep the Show on the Road!

Eric, In a word, Mold....... I really don't know, but judging by everything else, including my driveway and the outside concrete steps to the basement, I would guess some organic surface growth....but like I said, I really don't know. Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Mike, Thanks for the come-back! Rereading your 2009 journal (nothing like a bike trip to view an old road!!), I note you mention and include a photo of another single slab concrete segment north of Burlington, Washington, of which I was not aware. I did not however find mention of other early examples (pre mid 1920's) in Washington. You note “a few stretches like that in the area,” so I'm hoping from your memory or photographs you might identify others. If you identify where some of those other sections of old Pacific Highway original concrete in the area are, I would really enjoy taking a look at them. And you didn't note for readers your outstanding tour site which I have cited below: http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/doc/index.html?o=1&doc_id=5240&v=9b Thanks again for the great information! Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Every so often I “discover” a great new website I want to let others know about. This one will prove to be very useful for anyone interested in the Pacific Highway or US99 in Washington: http://www.ilwu19.com/pacific_hwy/index.htm I have contacted the author and invited him to share his expertise with us. Speaking of the Pacific Highway, I “discovered” some original concrete pavement yesterday. Sit Properly (Eric) asked me for examples I knew about of concrete pavement in Western Washington. I suggested a couple I knew about, then decided to see if some places I thought might have old concrete surfaces, did in fact. The photos below show what is almost certainly a segment of original and very rare concrete pavement on an abandoned section of the old and famous highway. It is pre 1923, based on the lack of a center joint. Given when concrete was first used on highways (abt 1913), and specifically on the Pacific Highway (1916, or perhaps as early as 1914), concrete laid on the Pacific before 1923 was very probably not a replacement hard surface pavement, and thus was the original. I hoped to find a date stamp, as is the case on the 1919 concrete near Reardon, Washington, but I didn't. Of course that stamp was impressed at the end of the section laid each day, so I may have been in the middle of a day's section, and frankly, I didn't check every cross joint anyway For Google Earth fans, go to coordinates 46.461177°, -122.838643° (Laussier Road, north of Toledo, Washington). It will be tough, perhaps impossible, to find another such section in Washington. I did spot (not claiming discovery) an original 1915 concrete bridge in California a few years ago, but we all know that Washington trumps California!! See it here: http://americanroadmagazine.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=1163&hl=%2Bpacific+%2Bbridge Dave Keep the Show on the Road! Looking east toward “modern” old US99 Below.....Looking west toward road closure barrier.

Rick, Ah, yes, the good old days. For those who weren't there, it was almost an expectation that we would be in an atomic bombing. Hiding under your school desk was a routine drill. Of course school desks in those days were made of cast iron and thick wood, and might have actually been of a little use as protection. I worked at a college in the early 1980's that was built in the Nike period. It had narrow vertical slits for windows, to reduce the glass and blast impact on students. Ah, the memories. I'm glad I'm still here!! But back to your comment about military sites on either side of the Golden Gate. Is Fort Point still an attraction on the south end of the bridge? I don't think I ever visited the Nike installation, but my days in the Bay Area would have been when the site was active, and I doubt the public was invited to tour. I have an old 8mm movie I took of the north end of the bridge, but no Nike's in view. Dave Keep the Show on the Road

Alex, Loved your post!! Great word images of what it was like "on the road" back when!! As you know, there is no sense in driving the interstate with the hope of seeing anything. I have a copy of the study/proposal for the interstate past spectacular Lake Coeur d' Alene in Idaho. It promises beautiful views of the lake. Only problem is that they built 8 foot walls along the road, probably to prevent anyone from being distracted on the curves doing 70 while trying to see the lake. Anyway, your descriptions were great. Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Jeffery, Are you referring to Beales Pass? That post is at: http://www.americanroadmagazine.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=561&hl=%2Bbeales+%2Bpass Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Jeffery, I didn't think it was a service pit at the time because the open end was never deep enough to allow a standing person. But your comment that cars were serviced outside made me think. Is it reasonable that it was a service pit that you rolled into on a service trolley? I worked in a service station in my late high school and early college years, and serviced cars up on a rack. It never was a great position for many operations because you had to always reach over your head. It is actually more comfortable on your back. In fact the owner preferred to get under cars on a flat four wheel trolley rather than use the rack. That would allow for a shallower pit, less expense, and a more comfortable working position. What do you think about that possibility? Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Maria, Now here is something we don't normally find, a photo of a roadbed they drove on, from a book published in the year they did it. The book is the 1929 AAA Northeast Tour Book. The photo of the Bear Mountain Bridge with the road in the foreground is the exact road they were on. You can tell because they approached the bridge from the south east and the small inlet in the distance beyond the bridge comes in from the north west in Google Earth. Ergo the photo shows the actual roadbed where they rolled rubber (in those days tires were still made of rubber). Step back in time and see them marveling at the view as they drove that exact pavement. I'll post some of the strip maps ASAP. In the meantime, suppose that they belonged to the AAA and used the same issue tour book.....a long reach, but not out of the question. Fun imagining. Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Maria, I am always pleased when Denny "chimes in!" As you will come to know, he is very familiar with all that goes on in the two lane travel world. You will probably bump into him on the road, by design or happenstance, when you take your trip. And unlike me he isn't lazy, so he actually looks up references, and provides links to important sites. What a refreshing concept! Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Maria, Here are the Rand McNally 1928 maps for a route between Hawley (Lake Wallenpaupack ) and Erie, on the second day's run. I'm guessing they stayed on US6. A small argument for my guess is that US6 was considered a transcontinental route. And BTW, it has fans today, and I wouldn't be surprised to find a web site. I know American Road has done some stories about the route. I am a charter subscriber (ten years now) and I highly recommend the magazine (and the good people who publish it). I'll post some 1929 strip maps as soon as I get the time. I dug deeper in the “archives” and came up with a 1929 AAA Tour Book with strip maps of the Northeast. I can even imagine that they might even have carried one like it! I know I have some more Pennsylvania map sets but I have only been through about half the boxes. One handicap is that I mostly accumulate stuff from the “auto trails” era which ended (in my view) when the federal (national) numbering system came into being in 1926, and showed up in 1927 maps. And being a westerner, I have more from my area than the east. On the other hand, your project has already introduced me to some fascinating and beautiful roads and sites in the east. I am enjoying the ride! And they are headed west!! Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Jeffery, Maria Jeffery, I have located a copy of “Mixer's Road Guide and Strip Maps” in the “archives.” It is a 1926 edition and was published by the New England Hotels Publishing Corporation of New York City. It covers, as you might expect, New England, and as far west as Cleveland, and like many guides of the period, down to Florida. Mixers is divided into two sections. The first section contains about 800 strip maps along with mileages and highlights along the route. It also displays the locations of hotels and a few garages and restaurants, all probably members of some New England Hotels organization. The second section is called an “index” but is more a compilation of town descriptions and hotel ads. I note that a couple are available on Ebay at this moment. Maria, I am posting below the strip maps from Mixer's that cover the route I guessed at. Mixers didn't publish a strip map for the segment from Milford to Hawley. The mileage from Bridgeport to Danbury via the Turnbull (via Newtown) route is 25.6 miles, that from Danbury to Goshen via the Bear Mt Bridge is 69.6 miles, from Goshen to Port Jervis is 23.5, and from Port Jervis to Milford is 7.2, a total of 125 miles. Adding the 25 miles from Milford to Hawley, using the Rand Mc Nally maps posted earlier, I get 150.9 miles compared to the 150 the young women reported. If it is the route taken, it was a lucky guess. It was a guess and not as logical nor well considered as is Jeffery's discussion. I am however finished with this segment and will post the next segment as soon as I can. Dave Keep the show on the Road! PS Maria, Here is another wild guess....they camped at the Wilsonville Camp on Lake Wallenpaupack. Why this guess? It is right next to US 6 on the lake where you note in the blog that they camped, and it is cited as in operation in 1934 in the Pennsylvania Angler. The lake was developed by dam in 1926, and the campsite was a natural location adjacent to the highway. It might be fun to write the Wilsonville superintendent and see if you can get a firm date for when it was first opened. Just a thought.

Jeffery, MGA707, Glad you guys enjoyed it. Funny thing, I have all this "stuff," but it takes someone like Maria to get me to dig through it and read some of it carefully Jeffery, your points are well take regarding the route. I am going to dig a little deeper in the "archives" and try to locate a Mixers Road Guide from the period. They have strip maps showing mileages down to the tenth of a mile, but I don't know if they covered the route the women took. Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

One of the pleasures of following your blog and posts is that it prompts me to dig through my “archives.” Those familiar with my “archives” recognize them to be stacks and boxes of old travel books, magazines, and maps collected over the past 30 or 40 years, and mostly unorganized. The organization part might make them a “collection,” but it has not happened in the past and has no likelihood of happening before I croak, so I call them an “accumulation.” In the accumulation are a number of old automobile magazines, and in the September 1929 issue of the Syracuse edition of American Motorist (AAA affiliated) I found an article you might enjoy. It describes an auto trip by two “eastern girls” to the Tetons. Having myself taken the road they took at least three times, I enjoyed it just for that alone, but it also contains a wonderful description of how men treated them on the road. It recalled our discussion of a day or two ago. I couldn’t resist seeing what I could find out about the author. Google Books has a snippet. Frances Randolph Weber is cited in 1929 (Themis of Zeta Tau Alpha, V 27, Issue 4) as “for a time the only female columnist in Washington DC” and later as working as a journalist for the AAA. The passage I note is on the third page, first column. (Double click to enlarge) Quite a bit else in the article should be of interest to you and others here. I am providing this from my vast fund of knowledge (The intended humor will be evident after you read the passage. ) Great fun!! Dave Keep the Show on the Road

Maria, It is great that you have the mileage for this segment, and I hope it will shed light on which route was taken. I think it will be easier to identify the most probable route the further west they go. The roads are fewer and the main traveled routes better identified in period literature. I read your last two blogs (Jan 23 & 25) together. I haven't studied the role of women in the early years of automobiles as you are, but over the years I have read hundreds (probably thousands) of pages of early articles that in one way or another depict the role of women related to automobiles. There isn't much I could add to your excellent summation...save one. My recollection of my random reading is that women were often trivialized or patronized. For example many articles and features focused on fashion...what the “lady wore to drive or travel.” I don't recall an example where they were cited as opinion leaders in discussions of automobile laws or policies. Perhaps the single exception to that is that women were the leaders in establishing certain historical highway designations. The Old National Trails, and the El Camino Real in California come immediately to mind. Even in these instances they often had that standing because they were married to men of standing. Again, as almost always, I am no expert on the subject, but early road travel in this country is definitely an interest of mine. There was a time not long ago when it was very difficult to find source material. You owned it or you drove to where it resided. Today with sources like Google Books, I have a vast library 18 inches away!! I look forward to your next post! Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Maria, 32vid was kidding about "secrets." I'm glad you have the mileage for this section and I especially appreciate you being willing to share your knowledge and information...... and interact with us. Tell me when you have finished with your analysis and I will post another map segment. Thanks again. Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

32vid, Your guess is as good as mine....or better! Your post is exactly what I hoped Maria would get. I have already had fun with this section. The Bear Mountain Bridge was a completely new item for me, and one that turns out to be pretty spectacular. That Denny didn't know about it adds icing to the cake! I also discovered a Civil War monument in the middle of their route in Peekskill (where Highland veers left off Division going north toward the bridge) which is really evident in Google Earth, and is cited in the 1927 ALA Green Book. They are certain to have seen it because they veered left onto Highland. Then Maria said they camped in Hawley. I may check my auto camp references to see if I spot a camp in Hawley. In late 1920's Boy's Life magazines there is an ad for a boy's camp in Hawley, but I doubt it was also an auto camp. And BTW, there is a big stone mill in Hawley which is very visable in Google Earth, and is cited in the 1933 ALA Green Book. (A tiny correction to your post for those looking at the map, it is a 1928 map. It is the ALA Green Book that is 1927.) Thanks again for your post, right on target!! Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Maria, et al Here is my first “guestimate” using a 1928 Rand McNally (Double click to enlarge). The original US6 is the main through route for their first destinations (Hawley, and then Scranton, PA). They would have picked up US6 as soon as possible after they left Bridgeport, which means they would have taken 122 or 124 to Danbury. In 1927 122 was mostly “tarred macadam” while 124 was “mostly macadam.” It was 27.9 and 27.7 miles respectively to Danbury. (pg 248-249 of 1927 ALA Green Book). BRIDGEPORT TO PORT JERVIS They then followed US6 from Danbury to the Bear Mountain Bridge. The highway in 1927 was “all macadam and concrete. The 1927 ALA (pg 257-258) spends nearly a page describing the route. In 1927 the toll on the Bear Mountain Bridge across the Hudson was 75 cents per car and 10 cents per passenger. Built in 1924, the beautiful suspension bridge, which is still used, was for a short time the longest suspension bridge in the world (Wikipedia). The young women certainly marveled at its beauty and that of the Palisades Interstate Park. I will suspend my “research” and post this now, but I will pick it up ASAP. I hope others will add their knowledge as I am not expert at all on this area. (BTW, I don't know if I have a 1929 ALA. The 1927 was on the table, so I used it to get started.) Dave Keep the Show on the Road! PORT JERVIS TO SCRANTON

Maria, I have a question. I have dug out a 1928 atlas (didn't find a 1929) and I can either post sections or send them directly to you. I think it might be fun if you and others looked at a series of maps covering sections of the route and made some informed judgments about which roads were taken. It might even add to your research and support your final determinations. On the other hand it might intrude into your work. I'm thinking though that a healthy dialog, and even differences of opinion, might strengthen your conclusions and probably introduce some information that might not otherwise come to your attention. What do you prefer? Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

OK, I'm warning you!! 3 Points... Joke! I have no idea what they are. How about "demerits." When I was a cub scout we got "demerits," and I think they went either "into your file," or onto your "permanent record." Or worse yet maybe they are like points on your driver's license or auto insurance. You get so many forum warning points and up go your rates, or you have to renew your driver's license every 6 months. I know for sure I don't went any of them there warning points!! Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Maria, I have enjoyed reading your blog, including of course the most recent entry. It prompted me to wonder how Sinclair Lewis had referred to Clair in Free Air (1919). Clair is twenty-three, a “young woman” today. As she drives her father across country, how is she addressed and described? In the very first paragraph he states “She felt like a woman, not a driver.” On the other hand, on page 13 she is said to have managed “her circle of girls...” By page 18 she is called a “young lady” by an older woman. I have never read the book, only scanned it for relevant travel information, but young males appear to be consistently referred to as “young men.” It would be interesting, and perhaps pertinent to your work, to compare how women, young or not, are portrayed as drivers and automobile travelers in say 1909, 1919, and 1929. As you know, there is a good deal of discussion in the road travel oriented magazines over the years on the topic. I have my own “impressions,” but there are not carefully developed. I look forward to your future posts. Dave Keep the Show on the Road

Hi Maria and WELCOME! We have communicated on your exciting project elsewhere, so I will just say it is great to see you here and we all look forward to learning more about the project!! Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Jim, You are correct there! If you had slick seat covers, as was often the case in those days, try a sharp left turn before the day of seat belts and you were suddenly trying to steer from the passenger's side! That happened to me a couple of times, and it wasn't a good feeling! On a winding mountain road the rule was to brace yourself on the transmission hump that was in the middle of the floor. Dave Keep the Show on the Road.

32vld, Well, if we are going to tell tear jerker stories, I might as will add two. First, I am getting teary eyed reading that 70 year olds are elderly. I am past that milestone and prefer to be called chronologically advanced. Second sad story: I owned one of the first three, perhaps the first, Miata in Washington. I flew across the state to the dealer who got the first three in stock, and bought one on the spot. I really loved that car. It reminded me of my MGA, Triumph, and Spyder. But Sheila has a back problem and sitting with her legs straight out was a problem. Then I took a job that required a two hour commute on the interstate in rain and snow. Driving in snow and rain at 70 along side a semi in that tiny car was life threatening. It was like driving in a car wash. The final blow came one evening coming back from Seattle. It had snowed and the light little rear wheel Miata with it's wide tread didn't even try to stay on the road. I had to pull off immediately on old US99 and find a motel. I can tell you from that experience that not all old mom and pop motels are charming. It was before cell phones were popular, and when I used the room phone I couldn't get the handset out of my hand.....it was too sticky. I couldn't afford to keep the Miata just for the Northwest summer so it had to go. I truly and honestly had a tear in my eyes when I handed the keys to the new owner. So much for the tear jerkers. I had a buddy in high school (1954-58 era) with a 1950 Ford V8. I drove a Chev 6 which was no match for the Ford. Strange the things you remember when you're chronologically advanced. Both had Three on the Tree, but the Chev had, for some reason, a smother shift. When you were driving and held your hand on the Ford shift lever you could feel every vibration in the manual transmission. We both had suicide knobs (who can remember them?!) so we could drive with one arm around our girlfriends (remember bench seats!!?). The real art was reaching with your left hand through the spokes of the steering to get at the shift lever mounted on the right side of the steering column, while steering with your knees, all without appearing awkward. The Ford shift lever was looser and you could throw or flip it with your fingers, while the Chev was smooth, but stiffer, presenting a handicap. The kids today don't know what they are missing!!! Kind of makes ya sad! Dave Keep the Show on the Road!

Rick, et al I stumbled across this air photo of the Mossdale Crossing in the May 1925 edition of California Highways. The topic is pretty cold now, but I thought the image might be ingteresting to some forum members. Dave Keep the Show on the Road! http://www.historicalroadmaps.com/americanroad/Mossdale.jpg

Regarding ABB transcontinental editions; search for Google Books, go there and search Automobile Blue Books. About 5 listings down is a Western and Transcontinental 1923 edition. Regarding the first transcontinetal auto race and your interest in US20: I haven't studied the route east of Idaho, but in Idaho and Oregon they followed much of what is US20. If you get interested I can help. I know if I was crossing those states on US20 I would learn beforehand the route they took so I could roll my wheels in their dirt ruts. Dave Keep the Show on the Road!