Guest Lulupic66@aol.com Posted February 4, 2005 Report Share Posted February 4, 2005 In a message dated 4/26/03 7:54:44 AM Central Daylight Time, wefly66@earthlink.net writes: << Favorite place where '66 crosses herself? Devils Elbow, MO -- 40's 4 lane alignment crosses the 20's alignment that actually runs through Devils Elbow. >> I know exactly what intersection that you are talking about if you are headed north on that intersection? On the west side of that alignement there is an old Motor Court Lulu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike Ward Posted February 4, 2005 Report Share Posted February 4, 2005 Dave, Thanks for the good words. I've put a spreadsheet in the American Road files (MAPDATING.xls) that lists most of the known road map date codes. This should help list members date some of those old road maps they have, particularly when the maps didn't have an easily recognizable copyright date. There are some cartographers that never seemed to put a decipherable code on any of their maps so it falls to checking known alignments of roads against what is shown on their maps to try and narrow down a publication date. Mike > Gas station maps also are hard put to tell you when, > for starters, most of them have no copyright date. > I suspect this was to forestall their obsolescence. > The motoring public might well be skeptical of last > years map, even enough to change brands perhaps. As to dating gas station maps, most had a code along the edge which gave a clue to the if you know what the codes mean. Most of these were made by Gousha or Rand McNally or some other map maker for the gas companies, and each map maker had their own unique coding. List member Mike Ward knows a lot more about this than I do, so hopefully he will chime in here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com Posted February 4, 2005 Report Share Posted February 4, 2005 Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the AMERICAN_ROAD group. File : /MAPDATING.xls Uploaded by : flyboy46.geo <flyboy1946@hotmail.com> Description : Are you trying to find out how old that road map is? Here's where you may be able to find out. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AMERICAN_ROA...s/MAPDATING.xls To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, flyboy46.geo <flyboy1946@hotmail.com> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest David G. Clark Posted February 4, 2005 Report Share Posted February 4, 2005 --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Ward" <flyboy1946@h...> wrote: > Dave, > > Thanks for the good words. I've put a spreadsheet in the American >Road files (MAPDATING.xls) that lists most of the known road map >date codes. This should help list members date someof those old >road maps they have, particularly when the maps didn't have an >easily recognizable copyright date. Thanks Mike. Old maps are valuable as a document of more than just the roads. One map Mike scanned for me last year is a 1930s vintage Gousha map distributed by Standard Oil of Indiana. The map features "S" symbols on the map everywhere a filling station selling their brand of gasoline was located. This helped me to determine that a service station near Chicago which still operates as a repair shop (no pumps) was indeed a Standard Station 70 years ago. Dave Clark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jim Ross Posted February 4, 2005 Report Share Posted February 4, 2005 Dave, et. al., It's good to see some real chatter on this list. Thanks to you and the others for this fun thread of highways crossing each other, reliability of maps, documents, etc. I have been preaching for years that the absolute most reliable sources are copies of actual construction plans, other official project data, or the minutes of annual reports that describe changes in detail at the time they were approved or completed. Even then there are trap doors to watch out for, but I'll save that for another post. It amazes me sometimes the lengths writers will go to scrounging up and studying maps until they are cross-eyed from conflicting information and then end up trying to explain every possible way it MIGHT have been, when in many cases a call to someone at their local DOT could have resulted in quick, official and accurate answers as well as documented proof to back it up. My favorite example of this relates to the challenge Jerry McClanahan and I faced in trying to ACCURATELY sort out the evolution of US 66 alignments through Arlington, MO. Rather than pull my hair out trying to determine which sources to rely on, I wrote a letter to MODOT and basically asked for the world. I asked for construction plans for I-40 that would show the "existing" road and aerial photos they might have. I also asked for any construction plans they might have for the first generation 2-lane paving that would also show the "existing" (dirt) road. In reply I got a huge package in the mail with all I asked for and more. As a result, we learned things that no one could ever have known about the tangle of roads between Sugartree and Jerome. I realize this is a best-case scenario, but you get the idea. And Kip is right on. Route 66, as an example, crosses itself in so many places it could make a fun trivia game. I'm sure the same is true for many of our other historic highways. Jim R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest David G. Clark Posted February 4, 2005 Report Share Posted February 4, 2005 --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Ross" <pathfinder66@e...> wrote: > > I have been preaching for years that the absolute most reliable sources are copies of actual construction plans, other official project data, or the minutes of annual reports that describe changes in detail at the time they were approved or completed. Even then there are trap doors to watch out for, but I'll save that for another post. Jim: Most of my research has been of the period of the 1920s-1930s, long before the Interstate era. I have contacted a few folks at IDOT who have been quite nice, but they say that all records that old have been given to the Illinois State Library. The library has the records in storage, and at this point no one has gone through them to create any sort of index, catalog, or any organization whatever. "Sitting in a locked room, in boxes, no order to anything" is the way they were described to me. Annual Reports are available from the Division of Highways from this period, as well as an old publications such as the Illinois Highways newsletter of 1915-1917. But these are general, as opposed to specific, and are valuable for some excellent insights into the time period when good roads just did not exist in the way we think of them today. (Actually, the annual reports can be numbing in specificity if you want to know the annualized interest compounding on EACH and EVERY road bond. That's just not the kind of "specific" I'm looking for.) Great stuff from the reports include descriptions of the items that the first highway patrolment carried, which included some sort of portable device for weighing trucks to ensure they were not too heavy. Also, they would specifically list some projects or construction done in the year covered, but other jobs would simply be tabulated by county or totaled by work performed by a specific road crew. I'm sure info on the 40s forward is much more readily available. I've been to the IDOT library in Springfield and will be going again when and as necessary. Also, the I have just skimmed the surface at the Libraries of the University of Illinois, both in Chicago and Champagne and there is much more to be done at both. > > It amazes me sometimes the lengths writers will go to scrounging up and studying maps until they are cross-eyed from conflicting information and then end up trying to explain every possible way it MIGHT have been, when in many cases a call to someone at their local DOT could have resulted in quick, official and accurate answers as well as documented proof to back it up. > And this has been quite true of of several contacts I have made at the Cook County Highway Dept and two folks at IDOT. The city of Chicago says I have to fill out an official request per the Freedom of Information Act. I'll do that of course at some point, so far I've had plenty of info from other sources. Dave Clark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rob Carnachan Posted February 4, 2005 Report Share Posted February 4, 2005 David, Corner Bakery is the one I was thinking of. Rob Carnachan >From: "David G. Clark" <olympia66@netzero.net> >Reply-To: AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com >To: AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com >Subject: [AMERICAN_ROAD] Re: Chicago walking tour (was (unknown)) >Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 00:06:05 -0000 > _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rudkip@sbcglobal.net> Posted February 5, 2005 Report Share Posted February 5, 2005 Thank you for the correction! Yes, it is Lebanon not Lincon...sorry for the mixup; my feeble mind sometimes gets its wires crossed...Tsingtao Kip ----- Original Message ----- From: "J Lance" <bugo@hotmail.com> To: <AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 9:41 PM Subject: Re: [AMERICAN_ROAD] Digest Number 700 > > AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com wrote: > > > > There are 2 messages in this issue. > > > > Topics in this digest: > > > > 1. Re: U.S.Route 50 question > > From: "Dave Johnsen" <dcjcycle@earthlink.net> > > 2. Re: American Sign Museum Opening > > From: "Jennifer" <jabremer66@aol.com> > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > > ________________________________________________________________________ > > > > Message: 1 > > Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2005 11:47:26 -0500 > > From: "Dave Johnsen" <dcjcycle@earthlink.net> > > Subject: Re: U.S.Route 50 question > > > > <rudkip@sbcglobal.net> wrote... > >> --50 piggybacks I-44 to Lindbergh Blvd. in St. Louis...then connects with > >> I-255 to cross the Misssissippi and follows that to I-64...it follows > >> I-64 > >> for several miles before veering off to Lincoln, IL...real cute little > >> downtown there.... > >> --outside of Lincoln you can turn right off of 50 and take old 50 through > >> Summerfield and Trenton...Trenton is a cool little town with lots of cool > >> signs, a great bowling alley and the Trenton House Restaurant, which may > >> have the best onion rings you will ever find... > > > > Um, you meant LEBANON instead of Lincoln, right? Maybe you've been driving > > Route 66 too much! > > > > There are a few other sections of old 50 further east, some of which are > > signed as IL 250 (Olney and Lawrenceville). Olney is known for its white > > (albino) squirrels. > > > > --Dave Johnsen > > Chicago, IL > > There's a great burger joint on US 50 in Sedalia, MO called Eddie's > Drive-In. Their steakburgers put Steak N Shake to shame. It's right in the > middle of town, on the south side of the highway. > > > > Visit our homepage at: http://www.mockturtlepress.com > > To subscribe to AMERICAN ROAD magazine, PHONE TOLL-FREE 1-877-285-5434 WITH YOUR ORDER TODAY! > Or send payment to: Mock Turtle Press, PO Box 3168, Lynnwood, WA 98046-3168 > SUBSCRIPTION RATES: > 1 year (4 issues) for $15.95 > (save $3.85 off the newsstand price!) > 2 years (8 issues) for $27.95 > (save $11.65 off the newsstand price!) > > > For questions about the list, contact: AMERICAN_ROAD-owner@yahoogroups.com > > To SUBSCRIBE to this group, send an email to: AMERICAN_ROAD-subscribe@yahoogroups.comTo POST a message via e-mail, send it to: AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rudyard Welborn Posted February 5, 2005 Report Share Posted February 5, 2005 Dear Friends: THE STANLEY COUR-TEL SIGN IS AGAIN WITHIN OUR REACH! As you know, a year ago there were efforts made to obtain the Stanley Cour-Tel Motel sign. This sign had been in place on Route 66 since the 50's, guiding people to a place which served many a traveler along Route 66. The Stanley was also the host motel for the Apollo 1 astronauts when they trained for the first manned space mission. Unfortunately, our efforts to obtain the sign at that time failed, as the owners of the sign decided to sell the Stanley Court-El sign, the Office sign, and the two signs at the nearby Lin-Air Motel to the highest bidder. Recently, the signs were discovered in a lot in North St. Louis County. The new owner of the sign has shown a willingness to part with the Stanley Court-El sign and the "Office" sign for $3,000.00. This is a considerable amount of money; however, it is considerably less than what the new owner paid for the signs and, more importantly, is an amount that is well within our grasp. However, to achieve this goal, WE NEED YOUR HELP! A donation from you would be of great assistance in bringing the signs back to Route 66. Please make your tax deductable donations payable to Friends of the Mother Road, Inc. Please put on the memo line of your check "Stanley Sign" and the money will be earmarked for that purpose. Please send all donations to: Friends of the Mother Road, Inc. 3947 Russell St. Louis, MO 63110 Your help in this endeavor will be greatly appreciated. If you have any questions, let me know. Thanks, Kip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest brownwho63 Posted February 5, 2005 Report Share Posted February 5, 2005 Eddie's Drive-In is a wonderful stop and the food is great. While in Sedalia, be sure to take a trip through the downtown area. Another trip into the past....Bliss > > There's a great burger joint on US 50 in Sedalia, MO called Eddie's > Drive-In. Their steakburgers put Steak N Shake to shame. It's right in the > middle of town, on the south side of the highway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WILEYOTTER@AOL.COM Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 In a message dated 6/2/2005 9:04:45 AM Eastern Daylight Time, drivetheost@yahoo.com writes: Isn't that suppose to be "piccaninies"? Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JWM Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 Greetings- We touch upon the Pacific milestone on our web site: http://www.drivetheost.com/ca.html.. To take the Lee Highway discussion a bit further, its basic alignment, except for a stretch between Memphis and El Paso, was recast in 1927 as the Broadway of America. Charles Taylor, a booster from Las Cruces, New Mexico, came up with the idea of the "Broadway" to counteract Route 66 to the north. Tired of losing traffic and business to Albuquerque and Santa Fe, Taylor and a group of El Paso businessmen formed the Broadway of America Highway Association, promising a new 100-foot wide highway from Broadway, New York to Broadway, Los Angeles. Its name had a bit of sophistication to it, and can be read as a less than subtle putdown to Route 66's more homespun "Main Street of America." Learning from the mistakes of earlier private highway highways, the Association wisely selected a route made primarily of already federally improved(85%)roads,promising America's first "all paved, all year, snow-free" highway. (They also got ahold of Col. Fletcher ASAP, who later claimed in his memoirs to have invented the idea himself!). Beating all odds, this last named highway prospered through the 1930s, while most private trail associations shuttered their operations. Predating Route 66, the Broadway of America had its own promo song. The number, the "Broadway of America," similar in structure to future Bobby Troup composition, moved along the highway, but instead of clever word play and reference to specific towns, pandered in the general and the cliche. For Kentucky the refrain goes, "fields of cotton and corn, where piccannies sing in happy glee." Ah, America in the 1920s. The significance of both highways is they originated in New Mexico, about 100 miles away from each other. JWM, drivetheost.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest parsa9 Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "JWM" <drivetheost@y...> wrote: > Greetings- Tired of losing traffic and business to > Albuquerque and Santa Fe, Taylor and a group of El Paso businessmen > formed the Broadway of America Highway Association, promising a new > 100-foot wide highway from Broadway, New York to Broadway, Los > Angeles. Its name had a bit of sophistication to it, and can be read > as a less than subtle putdown to Route 66's more homespun "Main Street > of America." I think that's broadway in San Diego, not Los Angeles. Do you have more detailed maps of the OST? Ones such as ACSC strip maps or detailed driving guides? All I've seen are the less detailed maps and guides on the Centennial site. I'd really like to drive the OST someday as I used to live in Tucson, Douglas (AZ) and Florida. The Trail goes through some of America's more interesting cities such as San Antonio and New Orleans, neither of which I've really visited as an adult. The OST probably did not follow the later 40s and 50s alignments of US-80 and 90 (see below). In fact one very old map indicates it followed CA-94 in San Diego County (through Campo). Old driving guides and city maps from the 20s are what's needed. That and exploration to find the concrete and old utility poles and such.... - The ironic thing about San Diego County is that it seemed to have a great many auto trail alignments, and ended up with three federal highways (80, 101, 395). Now it has no US highways at all, only the Interstates and state highways. It has a good share of those, but all the US routes are "historical." After examining web sites, visiting historical societies, driving around and looking at aerial photos, I've found a few old alignments of these highways in San Diego County. I discovered old bridges and concrete for the original path of US-395 through Fallbrook and Vista. Most people here don't even know it went that way. They normally only know about the post-40s alignment parallel to the I-15. I recently looked at aerials for old US-80, and sections of both the 1927 and 1941 alignments are visible. Most people know of the 1941 path and a couple web sites discuss travelling it, but the auto trails like the OST and Lee Hwy went along the older path. NGS and the San Diego County survey web sites list the benchmarks from the 1920s and 1930s. Even if the discs are gone, the former locations of them are known, and that helps find the road. Some of them would be very hard to get to, but I found one long accessible section right between the east-west lanes of I-8. (Many people know about the one at Mountain Spring already it seems.) I can also see a few little pre-1941 sections winding around the later road in places such as Jacumba. I'm thinking of putting notated aerials on my web site. Parsa http://ushighway66.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike Ward Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 I have a copy of the 1930 Automobile Club of Southern California book of strip maps for the Old Spanish Trail if anyone needs scans from it. Mike Ward ----- Original Message ----- From: parsa9<mailto:parsa9@yahoo.com> To: <mailto:AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 10:01 AM Subject: [AMERICAN_ROAD] Re: Lee Hwy/Old Spanish Trail (Pacific Milestone) --- In <mailto:AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com>, "JWM" <drivetheost@y<mailto:drivetheost@y>...> wrote: > Greetings- Tired of losing traffic and business to > Albuquerque and Santa Fe, Taylor and a group of El Paso businessmen > formed the Broadway of America Highway Association, promising a new > 100-foot wide highway from Broadway, New York to Broadway, Los > Angeles. Its name had a bit of sophistication to it, and can be read > as a less than subtle putdown to Route 66's more homespun "Main Street > of America." I think that's broadway in San Diego, not Los Angeles. Do you have more detailed maps of the OST? Ones such as ACSC strip maps or detailed driving guides? All I've seen are the less detailed maps and guides on the Centennial site. I'd really like to drive the OST someday as I used to live in Tucson, Douglas (AZ) and Florida. The Trail goes through some of America's more interesting cities such as San Antonio and New Orleans, neither of which I've really visited as an adult. The OST probably did not follow the later 40s and 50s alignments of US-80 and 90 (see below). In fact one very old map indicates it followed CA-94 in San Diego County (through Campo). Old driving guides and city maps from the 20s are what's needed. That and exploration to find the concrete and old utility poles and such.... - The ironic thing about San Diego County is that it seemed to have a great many auto trail alignments, and ended up with three federal highways (80, 101, 395). Now it has no US highways at all, only the Interstates and state highways. It has a good share of those, but all the US routes are "historical." After examining web sites, visiting historical societies, driving around and looking at aerial photos, I've found a few old alignments of these highways in San Diego County. I discovered old bridges and concrete for the original path of US-395 through Fallbrook and Vista. Most people here don't even know it went that way. They normally only know about the post-40s alignment parallel to the I-15. I recently looked at aerials for old US-80, and sections of both the 1927 and 1941 alignments are visible. Most people know of the 1941 path and a couple web sites discuss travelling it, but the auto trails like the OST and Lee Hwy went along the older path. NGS and the San Diego County survey web sites list the benchmarks from the 1920s and 1930s. Even if the discs are gone, the former locations of them are known, and that helps find the road. Some of them would be very hard to get to, but I found one long accessible section right between the east-west lanes of I-8. (Many people know about the one at Mountain Spring already it seems.) I can also see a few little pre-1941 sections winding around the later road in places such as Jacumba. I'm thinking of putting notated aerials on my web site. Parsa <http://ushighway66.com/> Visit our homepage at: <http://www.mockturtlepress.com/> To subscribe to AMERICAN ROAD magazine, PHONE TOLL-FREE 1-877-285-5434 WITH YOUR ORDER TODAY! Or send payment to: Mock Turtle Press, PO Box 3168, Lynnwood, WA 98046-3168 SUBSCRIPTION RATES: 1 year (4 issues) for $15.95 (save $3.85 off the newsstand price!) 2 years (8 issues) for $27.95 (save $11.65 off the newsstand price!) For questions about the list, contact: AMERICAN_ROAD-owner@yahoogroups.com To SUBSCRIBE to this group, send an email to: AMERICAN_ROAD-subscribe@yahoogroups.comTo POST a message via e-mail, send it to: AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AMERICAN_ROAD/<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AMERI CAN_ROAD/> b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AMERICAN_ROAD-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<mailto:AMERICAN_ROAD-unsubscribe@yahoo groups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Alex Burr Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 Drop the ca.html - opens fine after that. Hudsonly, Alex B --- JWM <drivetheost@yahoo.com> wrote: > Greetings- > > We touch upon the Pacific milestone on our web site: > http://www.drivetheost.com/ca.html.. > > To take the Lee Highway discussion a bit further, > its basic alignment, > except for a stretch between Memphis and El Paso, > was recast in 1927 > as the Broadway of America. Charles Taylor, a > booster from Las Cruces, > New Mexico, came up with the idea of the "Broadway" > to counteract > Route 66 to the north. Tired of losing traffic and > business to > Albuquerque and Santa Fe, Taylor and a group of El > Paso businessmen > formed the Broadway of America Highway Association, > promising a new > 100-foot wide highway from Broadway, New York to > Broadway, Los > Angeles. Its name had a bit of sophistication to it, > and can be read > as a less than subtle putdown to Route 66's more > homespun "Main Street > of America." > > Learning from the mistakes of earlier private > highway highways, the > Association wisely selected a route made primarily > of already > federally improved(85%)roads,promising America's > first "all paved, all > year, snow-free" highway. (They also got ahold of > Col. Fletcher ASAP, > who later claimed in his memoirs to have invented > the idea himself!). > Beating all odds, this last named highway prospered > through the 1930s, > while most private trail associations shuttered > their operations. > > Predating Route 66, the Broadway of America had its > own promo song. > The number, the "Broadway of America," similar in > structure to future > Bobby Troup composition, moved along the highway, > but instead of > clever word play and reference to specific towns, > pandered in the > general and the cliche. For Kentucky the refrain > goes, "fields of > cotton and corn, where piccannies sing in happy > glee." Ah, America in > the 1920s. > > The significance of both highways is they originated > in New Mexico, > about 100 miles away from each other. > > JWM, drivetheost.com > > > > A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pat B. Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 OK, I need some help understanding something here. I've been keeping track of the AAA guys and their journey along Route 66. However, I'm a bit perplexed as to the National Old Trails Road sign put up in Adrian, TX during their trip: http://www.aaa- calif.com/images/travel/route66/day11-13/DSC_0614.jpg Considering the path of the NOTR never came close to Adrian and Chicago, this is a major blunder. The NOTR hooked up with 66 in Santa Fe (old 66) and down into Albuquerque and on west onto 66 from there. Call me nitpicky, but is historical accuracy asking too much? Pat B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pat B. Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 Here's a shorter link: http://tinyurl.com/cdg5a --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "Pat B." <roadmaven@a...> wrote: > OK, I need some help understanding something here. I've been keeping > track of the AAA guys and their journey along Route 66. However, I'm > a > bit perplexed as to the National Old Trails Road sign put up in > Adrian, > TX during their trip: http://www.aaa- > calif.com/images/travel/route66/day11-13/DSC_0614.jpg > > Considering the path of the NOTR never came close to Adrian and > Chicago, this is a major blunder. The NOTR hooked up with 66 in Santa > Fe (old 66) and down into Albuquerque and on west onto 66 from there. > Call me nitpicky, but is historical accuracy asking too much? > > Pat B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike Ward Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 Pat, Not that I am advocating it in the slightest, but how long do you think it'll take before some "collector" decides those signs would look better in his house or on eBay than on the signpost in Adrian (whether they're historically/geographically correct in that location or not). Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: Pat B.<mailto:roadmaven@aol.com> To: <mailto:AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 12:35 PM Subject: [AMERICAN_ROAD] Re: National Old Trails Road/AAA guys Here's a shorter link: <http://tinyurl.com/cdg5a> --- In <mailto:AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com>, "Pat B." <roadmaven@a<mailto:roadmaven@a>...> wrote: > OK, I need some help understanding something here. I've been keeping > track of the AAA guys and their journey along Route 66. However, I'm > a > bit perplexed as to the National Old Trails Road sign put up in > Adrian, > TX during their trip: <http://www.aaa-/> > calif.com/images/travel/route66/day11-13/DSC_0614.jpg > > Considering the path of the NOTR never came close to Adrian and > Chicago, this is a major blunder. The NOTR hooked up with 66 in Santa > Fe (old 66) and down into Albuquerque and on west onto 66 from there. > Call me nitpicky, but is historical accuracy asking too much? > > Pat B. Visit our homepage at: <http://www.mockturtlepress.com/> To subscribe to AMERICAN ROAD magazine, PHONE TOLL-FREE 1-877-285-5434 WITH YOUR ORDER TODAY! Or send payment to: Mock Turtle Press, PO Box 3168, Lynnwood, WA 98046-3168 SUBSCRIPTION RATES: 1 year (4 issues) for $15.95 (save $3.85 off the newsstand price!) 2 years (8 issues) for $27.95 (save $11.65 off the newsstand price!) For questions about the list, contact: AMERICAN_ROAD-owner@yahoogroups.com To SUBSCRIBE to this group, send an email to: AMERICAN_ROAD-subscribe@yahoogroups.comTo POST a message via e-mail, send it to: AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AMERICAN_ROAD/<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AMERI CAN_ROAD/> b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AMERICAN_ROAD-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<mailto:AMERICAN_ROAD-unsubscribe@yahoo groups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pat B. Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 I'd bet by the time the Oklahomans are heading west to the Rendezvous in September, they'll have missed the opportunity to miss the signs! :-) --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Ward" <flyboy1946@h...> wrote: > Pat, > > Not that I am advocating it in the slightest, but how long do you think it'll take before some "collector" decides those signs would look better in his house or on eBay than on the signpost in Adrian (whether they're historically/geographically correct in that location or not). > > Mike > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Pat B.<mailto:roadmaven@a...> > To: <mailto:AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 12:35 PM > Subject: [AMERICAN_ROAD] Re: National Old Trails Road/AAA guys > > > Here's a shorter link: > <http://tinyurl.com/cdg5a> > > --- In <mailto:AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com>, " Pat B." <roadmaven@a<mailto:roadmaven@a>...> wrote: > > OK, I need some help understanding something here. I've been keeping > > track of the AAA guys and their journey along Route 66. However, I'm > > a > > bit perplexed as to the National Old Trails Road sign put up in > > Adrian, > > TX during their trip: <http://www.aaa-/> > > calif.com/images/travel/route66/day11-13/DSC_0614.jpg > > > > Considering the path of the NOTR never came close to Adrian and > > Chicago, this is a major blunder. The NOTR hooked up with 66 in Santa > > Fe (old 66) and down into Albuquerque and on west onto 66 from there. > > Call me nitpicky, but is historical accuracy asking too much? > > > > Pat B. > > > > > Visit our homepage at: <http://www.mockturtlepress.com/> > > To subscribe to AMERICAN ROAD magazine, PHONE TOLL-FREE 1-877-285- 5434 WITH YOUR ORDER TODAY! > Or send payment to: Mock Turtle Press, PO Box 3168, Lynnwood, WA 98046-3168 > SUBSCRIPTION RATES: > 1 year (4 issues) for $15.95 > (save $3.85 off the newsstand price!) > 2 years (8 issues) for $27.95 > (save $11.65 off the newsstand price!) > > > For questions about the list, contact: AMERICAN_ROAD- owner@yahoogroups.com > > To SUBSCRIBE to this group, send an email to: AMERICAN_ROAD- subscribe@y... POST a message via e-mail, send it to: AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > Yahoo! Groups Links > > a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: > <http://groups.yahoo.com/g roup/AMERICAN_ROAD/> > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AMERICAN_ROAD-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<mailto:AMERICAN_ROAD- unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > > Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pat B. Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 OK, I butchered this reply, but they'll be gone by September! That's what I get for mixing keyboards and cold medicine. :-) --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "Pat B." <roadmaven@a...> wrote: > I'd bet by the time the Oklahomans are heading west to the Rendezvous > in September, they'll have missed the opportunity to miss the > signs! :-) > > --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Ward" <flyboy1946@h...> > wrote: > > Pat, > > > > Not that I am advocating it in the slightest, but how long do you > think it'll take before some "collector" decides those signs would > look better in his house or on eBay than on the signpost in Adrian > (whether they're historically/geographically correct in that location > or not). > > > > Mike > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Pat B.<mailto:roadmaven@a...> > > To: > <mailto:AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com> > > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 12:35 PM > > Subject: [AMERICAN_ROAD] Re: National Old Trails Road/AAA guys > > > > > > Here's a shorter link: > > <http://tinyurl.com/cdg5a> > > > > --- In > <mailto:AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com>, " > Pat B." <roadmaven@a<mailto:roadmaven@a>...> wrote: > > > OK, I need some help understanding something here. I've been > keeping > > > track of the AAA guys and their journey along Route 66. > However, I'm > > > a > > > bit perplexed as to the National Old Trails Road sign put up in > > > Adrian, > > > TX during their trip: <http://www.aaa-/> > > > calif.com/images/travel/route66/day11-13/DSC_0614.jpg > > > > > > Considering the path of the NOTR never came close to Adrian and > > > Chicago, this is a major blunder. The NOTR hooked up with 66 in > Santa > > > Fe (old 66) and down into Albuquerque and on west onto 66 from > there. > > > Call me nitpicky, but is historical accuracy asking too much? > > > > > > Pat B. > > > > > > > > > > Visit our homepage at: > <http://www.mockturtlepress.com/> > > > > To subscribe to AMERICAN ROAD magazine, PHONE TOLL-FREE 1-877- 285- > 5434 WITH YOUR ORDER TODAY! > > Or send payment to: Mock Turtle Press, PO Box 3168, Lynnwood, WA > 98046-3168 > > SUBSCRIPTION RATES: > > 1 year (4 issues) for $15.95 > > (save $3.85 off the newsstand price!) > > 2 years (8 issues) for $27.95 > > (save $11.65 off the newsstand price!) > > > > > > For questions about the list, contact: AMERICAN_ROAD- > owner@yahoogroups.com > > > > To SUBSCRIBE to this group, send an email to: AMERICAN_ROAD- > subscribe@y... POST a message via e-mail, send it to: > AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ -- > ---------- > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/g > roup/AMERICAN_ROAD/> > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AMERICAN_ROAD- unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<mailto:AMERICAN_ROAD- > unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > > > > > > Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest R. Droz Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 Adrain, TX was on the Ozark Trails, according to the 1924 RMcN Auto Trail map. NOTR routing: http://www.marion.ohio-state.edu/fac/schul...ional/notr.html Ozark Trails - Note the "OT" marker - http://www.marion.ohio-state.edu/fac/schul...onal/ozark.html If the links get fudged: http://www.marion.ohio-state.edu/fac/schul...ils/trails.html Maybe they thought OT was Old Trails? -- ___________________________________________________________ Happy Motoring! _._._._.____~__ Robert V. Droz ( us98@earthlink.net ) [____________][___ U.S. Highways : From US 1 to (US 830) [________/____[_|__ http://www.us-highways.com/ ()() ()() () Route Logs - Standard Oil - Highway Makeover - Pics - Maps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bakerhab2003 Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 Well, at least they got it right about Albuquerque being on the NOTR. Helen --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "Pat B." <roadmaven@a...> wrote: > OK, I need some help understanding something here. I've been keeping > track of the AAA guys and their journey along Route 66. However, I'm > a > bit perplexed as to the National Old Trails Road sign put up in > Adrian, > TX during their trip: http://www.aaa- > calif.com/images/travel/route66/day11-13/DSC_0614.jpg > > Considering the path of the NOTR never came close to Adrian and > Chicago, this is a major blunder. The NOTR hooked up with 66 in Santa > Fe (old 66) and down into Albuquerque and on west onto 66 from there. > Call me nitpicky, but is historical accuracy asking too much? > > Pat B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pat B. Posted February 6, 2005 Report Share Posted February 6, 2005 That is true, and they look awesome. It'd be really good if they could get some of those put up throughout the entire length of the NOTR. But as Mike eluded to, they probably wouldn't be around for long. Pat B. --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "bakerhab2003" <Bakerhab@a...> wrote: > Well, at least they got it right about Albuquerque being on the NOTR. > > Helen > > --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "Pat B." <roadmaven@a...> wrote: > > OK, I need some help understanding something here. I've been keeping > > track of the AAA guys and their journey along Route 66. However, I'm > > a > > bit perplexed as to the National Old Trails Road sign put up in > > Adrian, > > TX during their trip: http://www.aaa- > > calif.com/images/travel/route66/day11-13/DSC_0614.jpg > > > > Considering the path of the NOTR never came close to Adrian and > > Chicago, this is a major blunder. The NOTR hooked up with 66 in Santa > > Fe (old 66) and down into Albuquerque and on west onto 66 from there. > > Call me nitpicky, but is historical accuracy asking too much? > > > > Pat B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Fred M. Cain Posted February 7, 2005 Report Share Posted February 7, 2005 --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Reynolds" <roustabout@s...> wrote: > As promised, I have uploaded four 1990 photos of the Kinzua > Bridge to the BabyBoomerBob directory. These include one with the > tour train in the middle, and one of the supports from underneath. > This is what it looked like before it was destroyed by last summer's > tornado. Where is the Baby Boomer Bob collection. Also, are there any plans to rebuild the bridge for future rail traffic? -Fred M. Cain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Reynolds Posted February 7, 2005 Report Share Posted February 7, 2005 --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "Fred M. Cain" <fredmcain@b...> wrote: > --- In AMERICAN_ROAD@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Reynolds" > <roustabout@s...> wrote: > > As promised, I have uploaded four 1990 photos of the Kinzua > > Bridge to the BabyBoomerBob directory. These include one with the > > tour train in the middle, and one of the supports from underneath. > > This is what it looked like before it was destroyed by last > summer's > > tornado. > > Where is the Baby Boomer Bob collection. Also, are there any plans > to rebuild the bridge for future rail traffic? > > -Fred M. Cain The BabyBoomerBob directory is in this newsgroup under Photos. The governor of Pennsylvania has declared that the estimated 45 million dollars needed to rebuild the bridge would be better spent elsewhere. The only rail traffic using the bridge was a little tourist train. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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