sit properly

Ok! Lots of info here! I've rerouted the first day to go through Dufur (I probably would have anyway). Also, there's an old alignment just south of that that I'll be taking. Also, I'll be taking older alignments south of where 97 meets 197. The day will look sort of like this. For the next day, I pretty much just took your advice, which changed the whole day for me. Thanks! I can easily maintain 70mph, but that's really not a lot of fun. I had never heard of Fort Rock before. Just checked out a picture of it. I NEED to see this. Thanks! I'm not sure about Fandango Pass though. Is that CA-299? Anyway, Day Two looks mostly like this. As for where to post, you're right in a lot of ways - if nobody replies, why post? But also, there are a lot of lurkers here. They may not post, but they'll read (hopefully). Also, I'll be blogging about the planning and during the trip itself, so I might just find a way to cross post (even if it's just a link and a hello). Jim, I was pretty impressed that I heard back from them too. Maybe there's not much to do in that part of Utah. I'll probably make a summary post about the planning & routing. I'd love for some other ideas about roads along every part of the trip. I'll work on that. It's already up on my blog, but for the forum, I'll probably use GoogleMaps so that folks here can get more detailed. -Eric

I'll have to do some checking and research on the historical bits, but I have some good news! I got a reply from the county.... Eric, This road is all gravel. It is graded and in good shape at this point. It has some traffic on it depending on the day. Heavy rains can cause wash outs. Vehicles do not need to be 4 wheel drive but do need to have some clearance. It is a good gravel off road. Always be prepared. Good tires and water are always recommended. Have a good trip. Teri Taylor, Secretary Millard County Road Department Not bad! I can do gravel. I can even do small washes. The weather could be a factor, but by Memorial Day, it should all be pretty cleared up. Snow pack might be an issue over Oscala, but I'll be able to see that from the main road. The area from Ely to the boarder is beautiful. Amazingly gorgeous. I wasn't very unimpressed with Utah and I'm hoping that this old road can change that a bit. It's looking like this will be a long day. Might have to stop in Delta for the night. All my worries (well most of them) are gone. This should be quite a bit of fun. Incidentally, is the Trip Planning forum the place to talk about specific road trip planning or is it more of a generic overview (in a good way)? -Eric

I rarely find myself frightened of a road. This one, however, really scares me. First though, the history... I've been VERY lax in my research of the route. The name "Grand Central Highway" is completely new to me. A quick search brings up a few pages about it - that it was from SLC to Hinckley with a bit west of there. There's not much mention of it connecting to Ely, though I'm assuming it did. The "bit west of there" is the part that concerns me. Here's a potentially telling passage that I came across: It was not until September 1952 that paving was completed west of Delta, largely on a new alignment south of the old road. Business Week described the original route as "nothing but a wagon trail-rutted, filled with dust...one of the worst chunks of federal [sic] road in the country." A two day celebration was held in Delta to mark the occasion. The new alignment is where US 6 is now - I traveled it in 2008 and mostly it's pretty boring. Was Business Week using hyperbole in their description of the old road? Probably a bit. But it's clear that as of 1952, it was not paved. Looking at GoogleEarth it *does* appear to be paved or is gravel. Either would be fine(ish). Back to the history - it also appears that this alignment was part of the National Roosevelt Midland Trail from Washington DC to LA. Prior to 1922, it followed the Lincoln Highway through Utah, but after that, it used what is now US 6 from Santaquin, UT to Ely, NV. The Midland Trail was first signed in 1913, making it possibly the oldest transcontinental auto trail. (Help me out here, is this true?) Dave, the article you linked to is great, thanks so much! I will be traveling this in very late May. I traveled it in early June of 2008. There will be no cell coverage, you're right. SPOT is a great thing, but a bit out of my price range. The unit isn't bad at all, but the yearly subscription is $100. That's not bad for a whole year, but I'm only going to be traveling for three weeks. And only one day of those three weeks is actually dangerous (beyond normal Vespa-related dangers). There is one "saving grace" here. It appears that I will be traveling this road on Memorial Day. I'll be leaving Ely at dawn and will be hitting this old stretch by mid morning. There are ATV and hiking trails all around this road. Of all days, this one will bring some traffic. That makes me feel a little better. Also, there are a few connector roads to current US 6. Road conditions are still an issue and for that, I am emailing the secretary and director of the Roads and Noxious Weeds Department in Millard County (not sure why they handle both) and a general tourism person for the county. Hopefully I'll get some answers. Doesn't this 100 mile old alignment just call to you? How can I not take it? If I don't, I know that I'll regret it. That said, I do want to survive it. -Eric

Thanks! Glad to be of some service. Ok, here's the second leg of the trip (from Miami to Seattle). I'll post more about this on my blog and will see if there's a forum here to post in about it (since very little of the trip actually takes place on US 50 - or any specific road). And if I learn more about the segment of Old 6 & 50, I'll definitely post it here. -Eric

Dave! You and I think alike and that's great! I was just thinking that it would be neat if people could follow me via GPS. The safety was secondary (which in itself scares me a bit - hehe). I do know, however, that my mom would just love it. Thanks! I believe I'll be picking one of these up. I realize that in a place such as the middle of nowhere, a breakdown means roughing it big time. There's no cell coverage and if it's not a weekend, probably very little car traffic. I definitely need to think about this. Looking into Spot, I'll have to see how I could incorporate it into my blog and just how I could use it for safety. I think I'll definitely contact the county about the road. I've been on some REALLY nasty roads, but not for more than 20 miles. At this point, it would take a lot of convincing for me not to take this old alignment - I just want to know what I'm in for. Thanks! -Eric ps - A more detailed write up of my trip there is here. The trip back will follow in a couple of days.

Great about Osceola! There's a page about it here. Might be fun to see. The page is confusing as it says "You can follow ditch to town, but need to be an experienced hiker." Those directions seem to be from the Great Basin Park. The road from 50 looks very drivable. My biggest question is oddly enough not about a short alignment and ghost town that nobody's ever heard of, but about the 100 mile long stretch of Old 6 & 50 just after Osceola. It's strange how little information I've found on it. Actually, I've found nothing at all. There's some stuff about Eskdale, the Latter Day Saints spin-off group that has a commune there, but nothing about the road itself. Satellite images make it look like it's gravel, but that's always up to interpretation. There are some parts that look paved (I even see a car!). So any info on this stretch is VERY needed (in a life or death sort of way - I'll be on two wheels). The trip is from mid May to mid June. I'll be sure to hit late snow somewhere and nasty winds/dust storms somewhere else. I swore never to travel through the southwest in the spring again, but at least the wind will be at my back instead of in my face, slowing me down to 45mph... that is, until the return trip... As for the name of the trip, I'm not really sure. I've been pretty good about naming trips prior to this (Quick as a Turtle, Scoot 66, Short 66, etc). I almost named Scoot 66 "The Sprung from Cages Tour" from the Springsteen song "Born to Run" and I considered naming this one that, but that doesn't make sense to me unless I were to leave from Jersey (or at least the east coast). I even thought about taking the same route as you did for the Hypotenuse Trail, but I couldn't resist the allure of US 50 through Nevada on the way there and a bit of Route 66 in Missouri on the way back. But as for names... nothing yet. Hopefully soon. This is a rough outline of the trip... -Eric

Hi folks, I'm planning a Vespa trip from Seattle to Miami. Part of this trip will take me through Nevada & Utah on US 50. I have some old alignment questions. First, let's start the day at Ely, Nevada. I'll take 6/50 heading east through Majors Place and around the ghost town of Osceloa. Modern 50 loops around Osceola, but the last time I did it, I wondered if Old 50 ever passed through it instead of around it. I've heard that Osceola Road is in pretty nasty condition. After the Osceola area, traveling east, there are some old alignments on your left. A few are loops that reattach to the modern road, but one of them (White Pine County RD 41?) seems to cross the border and connect to a well-marked alignment called Old 6 & 50 (on GoogleMaps). My question here is was RD 41 ever old 6/50? My bigger question is about this Old 6 & 50 segment. It travels for about 100 miles to Delta. What is the history of this road? When was it used? When was it done away with? In what condition is it now? Paved? Gravel? Really crappy dirt? If I remember correctly, there is a gas station at the NV/UT border on modern 50, so I'll have to gas up there before heading out to Old 6 & 50, but it would be nice to know how the old road went into Utah from the Osceola. For reference, this is the area I'm referring to. Thanks!

Wow. I am literally floored that King County is trying to do this. I'm very thankful too. I've been on some of the roads, but not most of them. I think I'll arrange a little day trip focusing on those. Hopefully next week. Maybe even this week if it EVER stops raining!

As far as I know (and I don't really know much), there's been no contact about it. I very seriously doubt that the City of Seattle has even heard of such a thing as the Yellowstone Trail. The only mention of it that I know of is well outside of the city on the brick road portion. -Eric

That's White's Ferry, no? It's just off of US 15. I would go out of my way, even missing a wonderful section of US 15, to take it. It's got quite a history too, having started in the 1820s. A bunch of Civil War history too. Great ferry. Speaking of US 15, in Millersburg, PA, an old wooden sternwheel ferry crosses the Susquehanna throughout the warmer months. I remember there being some sort of Civil War reenactment there when I was a kid.

US20? Nice! I'm generally a fan of US 20 in Oregon. I'd be up for it. And nope, it hasn't spoiled me, I didn't find much at all in Spencer. You found the China and the insulator, Calder found some stuff, Sarah found the lions from the stove and the 1916 license plate (!!!) and I found... well, not much at all. There's that one raised roadbed thing that I found, but that seems really out of place (neat though). So nope, not spoiled, but itching for more! I've heard that they're soon expecting 12 - 16" of snow over the passes, which really does end the road season for me. Such a shame. But there's a long time to study up for next season! -Eric

Here is my After Action Report from here. Spencer, Washington was hardly ever a town. The name may have been around since the 1880s, but the Post Office was only there from 1911 to 1918. A hotel was also there at the time and probably lasted into the late 20s or early 30s. Not much seems to be remembered about Spencer. But for some reason, this lost ghost town (all buildings and traces of the place are gone), has captivated me. I've spend hours pouring over old maps, searching for references to it and trying my best to figure out not only what it was but exactly <em>where</em> it was. Spencer is somewhere in Moses Coulee, a canyon along US Route 2, about 20 miles east of Waterville in central Washington. No rail service ever graced this town. There was never a service station (that we know of) or a place to grab a bite to eat. But there was a post office and a hotel. Yesterday, we set about to find them. We met up with Dave (a fellow roadie from the American Road Magazine forums) who is also fairly obsessed with Spencer. After a tour of Douglas County's fine museum and a fairly fruitless attempt at finding out more about the town (nobody seems to remember this place at all!), we all head out to the site. Calder, Sarah, Dave and I tramped across the sage brush, trying to follow a road that has completely disappeared. A slightly later alignment of the Sunset Highway/Yellowstone Trail/US 2 is very accessible and open to traffic, but this old segment where Spencer lived is completely gone. Even traces of the road were impossible to find. Thankfully Dave had programmed the plot points that he got from a small bit of map work that I did into his GPS. We followed that, even though we were pretty convinced we found a site. It had some oddly placed rocks and an old tree limb that Calder found (there are no trees out here - so that was suspicious). The site turned out to be something (but impossible to say what). Still, we headed north, staying about .2 miles east of Jameson Lake Road and about double that distance north of US 2. Looking at the 1915 map, I tried to line up the telephone poles and thought that we should head farther north. We pushed on, moving past where we thought it was. Calder and Dave found a bit of metal from a can and I scurried off to find Sarah who found a clearing with no sage brush in it. Sarah's find turned out to probably just be a clearing (though why it was clear, I don't know). However, Dave found the motherload and we rushed back to check it out. Dave's find proved to us that he had found the site. He picked up a bit of glazed ceramic China which read "HOTEL" on in. This was it. It had to be. Around Dave's discovery (which I stupidly neglected to photograph!!), we spread out and found bits of glass, more china, tea pot handles, cold cream jars, medicine bottles and other various man-made things. As we moved north (the debris field seemed to spread north), Sarah found an object that gave us a date! She picked up a piece of metal and said "is this a license plate?" Sure enough it was! Way to go, Smartz! She had found a plate from 1916. That's impressive. What a lucky find! This was now definitely the place. We also found an insulator from a telephone wire, which proves that there was electricity here and that we had found not only the hotel, but the road (and probably the post office, which was right across the road from the hotel). This made all the hours of research worth it. I can't believe we actually discovered an old town site. It may seem like a trifling and silly matter to most, but for Dave and me (Sarah and Calder too - they grew to share my obsession, especially when we started to find stuff) this was a very good day. After the find, Dave had to head back, so Sarah, Calder and I did some more exploring of the Moses Coulee area and visited Dry Falls. I'd like to make some sort of small marker to indicate what's there. I'd also like to find some old photographs of Spencer. I'd be willing to bet that they exist, if only we knew of some historical society that could help us out with that.... You can check out all of my pictures here. *Edit - One thing I neglected to mention was how Spencer got its name. Nobody really seems to know. The person who runs the Douglas County Historical Society did a project on place names in Douglas County, but failed to come up with anything for Spencer. According to her research, nobody named Spencer lived there or owned properly there. However, I came across a P.K. Spencer who ran for two county offices in 1888. He lost the election for Prosecuting Attorney (receiving only one vote), but won the race for Joint Representative (253 to 207). This info can be found <a href="http://www.scribd.com/doc/13270117/1888-Douglas-WA-Precinct-Level-Election-Returns">here</a>. Now, exactly who P.K. was and what happened to him is anybody's guess. I'm not even sure that Spencer was named after him. But it's the only lead we've come across.

Dave and everyone! Tell the tale! I'm getting my photos together and will have them up tomorrow sometime. This discovery was really fun and on the way home it hit us that we discovered a "ghost town." That's pretty cool, if you ask me. We even drove a bit on the 1913 alignment west of the Coulee. I'm tempted to just get the pictures up now, but I'm totally exhausted. -Eric

Dave, No problem on the short replies. Just a quick note about Spencer. It was a post office only between 1911 and 1918. According to the map from 1915, it was on the north side of the road. The Motel was on the south (according to the ABB). http://genealogytrails.com/wash/douglas/post.htm (where I got the dated info). I also sent you an email. No hurry, just a question or two. I'm hoping to get out to Moses Coulee either this or next Thursday. I'll let you know. I've not got access to a GPS of any kind, so it'll be a hunt for sure. -Eric

Dave, I've also noticed the road that looks like a stream bed. And a washout makes a lot of sense, especially in a coulee. The hours of the historical society seem pretty good in the summer (open tuesdays - sundays or something like that). But in the spring-winter-autumn, it's by appointment only. You say "I also looked at the elevation of the site above the watercourse on the west side of the coulee...." and I'm not sure which site you're talking about. One thing that neither of us mentioned is that the road that would eventually become modern US 2 was there at the time (or really close to it) and went to a race track, made a few turns and then went through Baird and met up, after a couple more turns, with the main traveled road. The 1915 alignment skipped Baird (as it skipped Douglas). I wonder why this was. I'm not at all familiar with Earthpoint. I checked out their site and I'm assuming it somehow lines up old maps with GoogleEarth? Is this what you use? Spencer was mentioned on the YT and on the NPH - that was into the 30s. How about the ABBs? How late did they publish and what did they say? There was obviously a motel there. The post office was gone by 1918. How about a garage? Cafe? And what was Sulphur Springs? Was it really just a few springs? I found some maps on the Douglas County site. The first allows you to see a topo map that's sort of older and has the "middle" alignment on it very clearly. You have to select to view topo, but it's worth it. -It shows that the wash we were just talking about *is* (according to both the topo and the Douglas County mapping people) a stream. -It also shows a well north of the alleged Spencer site. Perhaps laying the 1915 map over this topo would be a fun way to kill an hour or so. You can select to only view topo. If you zoom in close enough, it reverts to an older topo that features the last alignment before modern US 2's current alignment (which I've been calling "The Middle Alignment" for lack of dates). You'll also notice that, just north east of the Sulphur Springs loop is a spring. And a road. Could this be the old alignment and the 1915 map's idea of where Sulphur Springs was? It does seem a little too far north of where it should be, but worth a check. Also, the church cemetery south west of the coulee (it's on th 1915 map) is shown to be St. Hubert Church. St. Hubert was the patron saint of hunters, mathematicians, opticians and metalworkers. If the church is still there, I wonder if they might have old photos, etc of the coulee, since it was so close. Anyway, The second is the Douglas County Road Atlas, a 63MB PDF ebook. You'll also want to download the Legend. Both are here. While this map doesn't tell you who owns the land, it does tell you which bits of land are public. There's a lot around there, in weird places, that is public land. For example, where I think you ran into the gate. There are a few other maps on their site that I don't quite understand. You might be able to make use of them though. Luckily for us, Douglas County is well mapped and uses an old topo. Ok, so some lovely finds for a chilly morning. -Eric

Dave, I totally agree with you on the western side. I admit, I doubted you a bit before, but this confirms it. Hoorah for you and hoorah for more alignments! As far as the eastern side goes, well, you're probably right there too. I did an overlay myself, matching up the odd little dip in 1st RD NE just east of the coulee and A RD NE on the west side. I found that the 1915 map is a bit off. However, not as off as I first suspected. I now believe that the Sulpher Springs loop was not used, that it was a later alignment, bypassing the steep grade that is now probably *under* US 2. On the 1915 map, aside from the western side's "loop" being a bit off, they also seem to have middle dip a bit off (or simplified). Also, the 1915 alignment (for lack of a better term) and the later alignment (we need dates!) probably met up after the later alignment returns from taking that longer, southerly jaunt as it descends the western side. There appears to be no way to perfectly match up the 1915 map with modern day GoogleEarth. It works in sections, but not as a whole. However, this is the desert. If there was a road there in 1915, there *should* be physical evidence of it. The 1915 map is an amazing outline. GoogleEarth offers a great overview and a few wonderful hints. But being there and actually exploring is what will prove it beyond a doubt (hopefully). So now I'm fairly confused. Where was Spencer PO? At this point, that little east-west straight stretch where it's supposed to be doesn't seem to be there at all. Unless the 1915 map has it as being more east-west than it really was. If you go to GoogleEarth and check out the "shiny" dirt road just north of US 2 and west of Jameson Lake RD... perhaps that is Spencer? Maybe that's the east-west straight stretch? It matches up on the map pretty well. Honestly, that is probably it. But again, how did it get up the eastern side? That will take a visit. Finding this 1915 map has been a curse! But a fun one. -Eric

Dave, Thanks so much! And thanks for the overlay video. Those make my day. Hopefully we get out there this next week. I was thinking that the PO/Motel was .2 miles *east* of Jameson Lake RD. I believe the 1915 maps to be a bit off. Were it seems on the overlay that the original alignment is just west of Jameson Lake RD, my opinion is that it *is* Jameson Lake RD. I could be wrong, but where Jameson Lake RD and Sulphur Springs RD meets seems like a good spot for the "turn left and Motel .2 miles on right". But I could be wrong. I don't see any trace of old roads aside from that. As for the Sulphur Springs loop, I'd like to believe that it used that road rather than the gully (which would be US 2, no?). This is where I believe the map to be off just a bit. I noticed that the little loop on the western edge of the Coulee is a bit out of scale, so I'm betting that it would throw it off. Finding the old motel/Post Office location would solve this whole thing. But if you look at Jameson Lake Road as it leaves US 2 - I believe that to be part of the old road (or very very close). Then I believe that it made that right turn and the motel/PO were .2 miles east. The images from GoogleEarth seem to support this as they show the old road traces (and more importantly, show no trace of old roads where the 1915 map would suggest they were. Great! I've got my work cut out for me, but I think we are ridiculously close to figuring this out. Actually, I think we've figured 90% of it out. Woo! Next, we should find old pictures of Spencer. I wonder what the Douglas County Historical Society could do. -Eric

I'm pretty sure I've figured out exactly where the PO is. It's not on any easy-to-get-to road at all. It's probably mostly cover by sage brush, etc. Find the PO and you've found the motel. I hope that I can get there Wed or Thur. This is great. -Eric ps - The church and cemetery (south west of the old road) would be fun to see too. pps - Got bored and pasted the maps together. It's not perfect, but close to. Also, I've figured out the wacky routing on this map. Next is making it work on Googlemaps and then in real life. It's a big jpeg (4mb-ish). http://www.littleblackstar.com/otherstuff/douglas.jpg ppps - After mapping this out, I went back to an older post because I remembered that I had a suspicion about the alignment just east of Sulphur Springs/Moses Coulee. Turns out my hunch was fairly right! Check it here. As for the Coulee's western side, there was *definitely* an older alignment (traces of which can still be seen - the upper loop, for example). It was very close to the current old alignment. My guess as to where the Post Office and Hotel was? Right at the intersection of Jameson Lake RD (which was part of the old alignment) and Sulphur Springs RD (which also was). Probably .2 miles east of there. On the right.

Here I go dredging up old posts again, but I'm not sure if Dave (or anyone else interested) really looked at this map... This shows the "exact" location of the Spencer Post Office in 1915. Not only that, it shows the telephone line (which both Dave and I found) and has a fairly accurate routing of the Yellowstone Trail Road. This map is interesting for a couple of reasons. First, the "Sulfur Spring Loop" isn't there. That mostly seen here - where Sulphur Springs is noted and the loop can be seen to be "incomplete." - in the bottom right corner. For awhile now, I've thought that the original alignment used the western part of the loop and then shot north east prior to "looping." It then leveled out in more of an easterly direction. Interestingly, a map of 1918 shows the more southerly route (now US 2) as ending, leaving me to think that the more northerly route (heading east out of the coulee - as seen here - bottom left corner) was the first road of choice - following the telephone line. So anyway, I've not held this up against the ABB directions, but thought that it would be fun to do so at some point. I may be heading back out there next week. I've a friend visiting and it's up to him. -Eric

Jim, Crashing the private roads really is always fun. However, in this case, it turns out to be pointless (aside from the views). The road I crashed by Mt. Index River Road and turns out that it was never part of the old road. The other private road, Foss River Road, I wish I could crash. Since I've decided that Mt. Index River Road wasn't part of it and Lowe Creek Road was (from Baring to Money Creek, skipping Grotto until 1912) that leaves only Foss River Road to figure out. That's the road with the HUGE boulder. I can't be the only one to have seen it, so I'm betting there are photos or stories about it. If so, well, good news for Foss River Road! But that's east of Skykomish. I'll figure that out later. That makes the new question: When and how was Skykomish connected to Scenic? It really never ends.

Dave, Yep, same guy. Neat, huh! I was thinking about a driving tour book. We shall see. All my knowledge is so scattered. The picture of the Flanders car was taken on the road from Index to Galina (on the Index side of the river). Also, the car used railroad tracks for some of the way (from Everett to Galina) due to poor road conditions. We also don't know if Flanders ever made it back. There is another picture of him getting his car towed by a donkey engine (also on the Index-Galena Road). It's pretty hilarious and safe to say that they didn't make it to or from Index on their own power and by the new county roads. http://content.lib.washington.edu/cdm4/ite...OX=1&REC=15 The 1911 date of the photo is correct. Pickett was pretty good with dating his photos. And it matches up with everything else going on. There are tons of pictures of the Flanders 20 driven by Flanders. But all of the pictures are around Index and Galina. As for the date, the bridge wasn't over the river from Index until 1915. The connection couldn't be before then. However, there is Mt. Index River Road on the south side of the river which could have connected Index to Halford (just north of Halford). To get to Mt. Index River Road from Index, you have to cross North Fork of the Skykomish (bridge in 1915) and the South Fork (bridge no later than 1921, but probably earlier). There are a bunch of pics of a bridge being built across the south fork in 1933, but according to a 1921 map, the road already crossed there, so this was a replacement bridge. Still, all of that is WAY too late. Maybe Mt. Index River Road wasn't there at all. I can't remember why I ever thought it was. The 1921 map doesn't show it. The 1910 doesn't show it, either. It's very, very possible that prior to 1915, there was no easy way to get to Baring from Index (apart from train). That might even be my conclusion. In 1912, Index was connected to Everett in the west and Halford was connected with Skykomish in the east. In 1915, Everett was connected with Skykomish via Index.

Dave, thank you, you're too kind. And trust me, I usually have a better camera, but it's Sarah's and she's in Boston for a few weeks (with the camera), so my ancient Pentax that has survived being dropped while riding at speed several times will have to do. Mike, Thanks a bunch for that info! Thank you! Somehow I missed that it was on the old railroad bed! And thinking back to it, it really shows. So the Chumstick line was added around 1929, so soon(ish) after that, it changed over to highway. Interesting. Thanks! The railroad history through there is really fun. Heck, the history of the place as a whole is great. How does this fit in with Saunders Road? I mean, that and North Road obvious predate the changeover, but how far does US 2 use the old RR grade? And at which point, east and west, does it cease to use the old RR grade? The more you know, the more you know you don't know. I take it that you've read the book White Cascade? I'm about to but am in the middle of Stevens Pass; Gateway to Seattle at the moment (it's quite good). Tonight's program about the Upper Skykomish Valley was really well done. It was mostly about the railroad (everything up there is) and only touched upon the highway in passing. I did, however, find out the exact date of when the first car rolled through Index. It was April 15, 1911. But there's a funny aside - it somehow used the railroad to do it. It did not use the road or perhaps placed rails under the tires so it would not sink into the mud. Also, I met the granddaughter of the guy who the bridge that connects Skykomish to US 2 was dedicated to. She said that the highway (US 2) was built a little before the bridge was put in. Maybe a year, but probably the same year. She didn't know when that year was, but she said it was in the 20s (which seems a little early, but who knows **EDIT** - actually, I just found out. It was 1939!). However, I bet that the photographer Lee Pickett was there and grabbed a few shots of it. That will give me the date. What I still don't know is this... When was Index was connected to Skykomish by highway? The bridge in Index was originally built because of the sawmill and Galina. The road connecting Skykomish to Baring was in place by 1912. So the real question is when was Index connected to that segment? Did it use the Mt. Index River Road like I suspect it did? And when was that segment abandoned in favor of the modern US 2 alignment? My first goal in this is to learn when every alignment came into and went out of main highway usage. Most of this research will have to be my own. It seems like everyone up that way studies the railroad. That's a great thing, of course (especially since trains are my first love), but it doesn't help much with the old road stuff. I'm going to have to get involved with local historical societies. Skykomish's is very active and probably worth joining up with. The fellow giving the talk tonight was Warren Carlson. His book Upper Skykomish Valley (from the Images of America series) looks great. I just picked up a copy tonight and I hope for it to provide some insight and maybe even an answer or two. Sorry for rattling on about this so. -eric

Haha! I did that once when I was moderator of a message board. No worries. Yesterday I rode 352 miles in a small attempt to see some beautiful countryside and mountains, rivers and roads. Also, to study old alignments of the Stevens Pass Scenic Highway (now a segment of US Route 2). I took the Vespa (Ruby II) and made a day of it, leaving at 7am and returning around 7:45pm. I took a ton of pictures, discovered some new things, got lost-ish, fell in love with the town of Index and generally had an amazing time. If you like, you can view all of the pictures from the day. Also, in this set are maps that I’ve made showing which roads I took, some speculations and some mistakes I made. It was great to be back on the road again. I just wish that I had a better camera to capture it all. Click here to check out the pics!

Ok! I'm back from Index. I'm completely in love with that place. The bridge was built in 1915, the same year that Index was connected to the outside world. I now need to find out when Index connected with the towns to the east. And tonight, I should find out... Tonight at the library in Monroe, there's a talk on the history of the area from Index to Stevens Pass. It's at 7 and I'll be there. Timely, no? I'll ask more about, well, everything. Working on the pictures, etc from yesterday. Should be finished today sometime. Perhaps tomorrow. -Eric

Ok, I found the map and you're right. Odd. I think I know pretty well where the suspension bridge would be. I think it's exactly where the bridge is today. The more I look at it, the more I think that it is showing the "Old Cascade Highway" alignment. If so, that's great because it gives me a date, 1912. I'm *this* close to calling it the 1912 alignment! Thanks! Now, the real question is where did the road go? Did it connect all the way to Index and farther west? Or did it merely connect Skykomish with Baring on the west and Scenic (where they were building the tunnel) on the east? Though the towns were isolated, some did have roads connecting themselves to each other. The other real question is when did the road extend beyond Index (technically, beyond Galina)? Once that is found, more pieces will fit into place. I'll be heading back to Index tomorrow and maybe I can figure this out. There is, however, an even earlier alignment (probably nothing more than a footpath) that I was unable to follow due to poor road conditions and time. I'll have maps of that tomorrow. And pictures. Tons of pictures. Very strange about the NPH. I guess what I'm doing is prehistoric NPH stuff. I'm fine with that. I hope we can figure all this out. It wasn't THAT long ago, somebody should know! I *did* find a 1920 bridge and old pavement today - that was lovely. Ok, sleep for me, I'll post all about this tomorrow. -Eric *Edit: According to the book Steven Pass; Gateway to Seattle by Joann Roe, Index was without a road of its own until 1915. The 1912 road still may have connected with Index (though I'm betting not), but that would have been three years before Index was connected to the west. According to this book, anyway. And according to the 1910 Snohomish Co. map, the only road that connected Index to anything (in 1910) was the road north to Galina, which was on the Index side of the river and a "trail." The next earliest map is 1927, so that wouldn't shed any more light upon this. My speculation is that the road from the west ended in Galina. Also, a series of roads connected towns in the east (though not across the pass), but not to the towns west of Index. But when did they finally build that bridge? Tomorrow I will find out. The date of Index's first bridge will tell me when they built the road across the river thus connecting west with east (so to speak).